posted by Winston Smith at
4:30 PM
Sunday, November 16, 2008
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17 Comments:
NEVER!
Deep Space Nine was the best!
/geek
I think DS9 was good...but the best?? Let's not be hyperbolic.
ST:TNG is the best series and VI is the best movie. These are scientific facts.
And I cannot wait until I see this new movie...it has a high disaster potential, but could it really be worse than Insurrection?
I think I've detected a small error in your first post, where I'm sure you meant to write "Star Trek is the best Star Trek."
The New Age Star Trek (or "Star Trek"), aka ST:TNG...well...what can one say?
I'll pick just two things:
1. Instead of a Science Officer, they have a "Ship's Counselor".
2. There's in which Picard actually tells someone: "Don't forget to put on sunscreen."
Not because there is a super-giant, super-hot sun about to eat the planet, nor because there is race that has developed a Sun Cannon...no, but...just because it's sunny.
I think DS9 is under-rated, but can't put it above the original.
DS9 was far and away the best.
1. Things that happened in one episode affected things in later episodes.
2. Realistic teenage characters (Jake and Nog)
3. Humans aren't perfect--or even assumed to be, and even the Federation is seen to have weaknesses.
4. Avery Brooks.
And most importantly:
5. No William Shatner.
Avery Brooks is awesome, I agree, and one of the best things about DS9.
Although...I must say...IMHO, DS9 suffers from a version of the TNG problem. Whereas the enemies in TOS are the AWESOMELY EXCELLENT KLINGONS, there is some sense in which the enemies in DS9 are the Ferengi. Kind of Bleh wimpy anti-capitalism...
OTOH, TOS has, in spades, one of the worst flaws a series can have, IMHO: the main character does basically EVERYTHING. It's all Kirk all the time. One reason why e.g. Buffy is so awesome is b/c the supporting characters are awesome in their own right. In TOS, Kirk basically does everything. I've even heard it said that other characters say that, on the rare occasion when they were actually supposed to do something interesting, Shatner would say "Hey, Kirk should do that!"
Plus you people are NERDS
Against your #3, I would argue that what is compelling about the Star Trek universe is that it offers to us human beings in something like a state of perfection.
What has always drawn me to Star Trek is that it holds out before us the image of a perfected humanity. We can become more. Our evil is not essential to our nature.
Long before Obama, Star Trek was offering us hope of a better future.
DS9's weakness, it seems to me, is that it shuns this humanistic hope.
Incidentally, WS, I think that ST:TNG gets the spirit of Star Trek better than the original series. ST:TNG is more likely to portray peaceful conflict resolution than the original series, which was more focused on action/adventure. TNG is more hopeful about and trusting in the human capacity to rationally persuade others in the community of sentient life.
(The weakness of TNG as I see it is that it gets a little too touchy-feely sometimes, especially in the character of the aforementioned 'Ship's Counselor.')
However, I have only come to this conclusion after long and gruelling arguments with my wife, in which I represented ST:TOS with pride. But we've been rewatching every episdode of both series, and I have to say: TOS is not as good as TNG.
Anyone who thinks TNG isn't the best Star Trek series is beyond help. No amount of rational argument can help this person.
I had dinner with Ampersand a few weeks back, and he had a standard 'geek test' he liked to give people.
He'd ask, "What is your favorite Star Trek series?"
If you had an answer, you were a geek.
---Myca
If you had no answer, you were immediately expelled from dinner.
That's an interesting point, Spencer, about ST as in part a fantasy about the perfectability of humans, and about TNG being better as a representation of that.
But...do they HAVE to be so annoying?
And:
The four types of TNG episodes:
1. The Holodeck
2. Wesley saves the universe
3. Feelings (wo-wo-wo feeeelngs...)
4. Data is a robot!!!!1 But he wants to be a real boy!!!1!
(Did you know that Picard was a Shakespearean actor? Few people do, and it is rarely mentioned by TNG fans...)
Illocano Avenger and I used to watch ST:VOY, which brought us the return of the half-breed, the uptight Vulcan, a more spiritual version of Tonto,the spoiled scion of an important Starfleet family, the stereotypical Asian geek, Barbie Borg, and more technobabble since I don't know when.
BTW, no less than 4 ST:TOS titles were taken from Shakespear. Lazy writers..........
This is interesting:
The opening line "to boldly go where no man has gone before" was taken almost verbatim from a US White House booklet on space produced after the Sputnik flight in 1957.
In the movie Trekkies It is told that as a child seeing Star Trek for the first time, Ms. Goldberg ran around the house screaming "hey Mom! Look! There's a negro woman on TV and she ain't cooking dinner!" Ms. Goldberg was eventually to portray the recurring El-Aurian female character Guinan on The Next Generation
The show’s cultural influence goes far beyond its longevity and profitability. An entire subculture grew up around the show and, anecdotally, there are indications that Star Trek has influenced many peoples' lives. This is apparent from the reported testimonials of people, such as scientists and engineers, who claim that their professional and life choices were influenced by Star Trek. Whoopi Goldberg, harking of Nichols' portrayal, was compelled to act and would later appear on TNG regularly. In addition, phrases like "Beam me up, Scotty", "Resistance is futile" (from the iconic Borg), and Treknobabble have entered vernacular. Words from the show including Klingon have been added to the Oxford English Dictionary, and "Trekkie" is the only fan label listed in that dictionary. Fictional devices in the show have also been claimed as inspirations for actual devices like mobile phones (communicator) and medical technology (hypospray).
Men Behaving Badly
In this British sitcom, the entire episode of "Watching TV" takes place as Gary, Tony, Dorothy and Deb are sat in the lounge watching an episode of Star Trek. Although the title is not mentioned, it is obvious from their descriptions the episode is TOS: "The City on the Edge of Forever".
As a fan of the series, Gary is keen to point out it's classic status, stating that it is as fresh as it always has been, and that it has taught an entire generation about science, the Klingon language, and how a crew of different nations can work together, "especially when there's no bloody Italians."
WS, you forgot:
5. Q annoys the crew for an hour
To be fair, though, there are about 6 different TOS episodes where they go to some "Eden" planet. Including the one where Spock hangs with the space hippies.
I repeat: space hippies.
OUCH...OH....space hippies... touche.
'tis not so deep as a well, nor so wide as a church door, but 'tis enough, 'twill serve...
Oh yeah? Well how about when the TNG gang beams down to the fitness/sex planet where the scantily clad gals (and...shudder guys) jog everywhere? Huh? Huh?
FAUGH!
I posted a BRILLIANT comment yesterday, and I return to find it's been EATEN!
1. Winston, you're kidding about the Ferengi, right? You didn't forget about five seasons of the Dominion? Or the Cardassians?
2. Spenser, that is why I don't care much for TNG. People are never going to be *perfect* and it's an utter fantasy to think we could. Although I agree that evil is not essential to your nature, that is because I don't think true evil exists.
People are often selfish, self-centered, and self-absorbed. They also often to the right thing for the wrong reason, and the wrong thing for the right reason. Unless you change the very nature of humanity, you're going to continue to have people doing the right things for the wrong reasons, and the wrong things for the right reason. That's what DS9 got right. Sometimes people get thing s wrong, but they have to keep trying.
3. Winston, Of course I know Patrick Stewart is a Shakespearean actor! Who doesn't know that?
Additionally, I believe most of the actors on DS9 have previous stage experience. Some Shakespeare, some other, but stage experience.
4. Avery Brooks.
:)
Also. I am NOT a nerd. I am a GEEK. The two are entirely different.
As an Eurasian growing up with few role models outside the family, I identified with Spock and his struggles with being from two worlds.
I even borrowed a plot twist from Journey to Babel when I had an improv in my acting class in college, and it was very effective.
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