Some Conditionals About Staying in Iraq
[1] If we'll make the world a worse place in the long run by staying in Iraq, then we should leave.
[2] If we'll make things worse for the Iraqis in the long run by staying in Iraq, then we should leave.
[3] If we'll make things worse for the U.S. in the long run by staying in Iraq, then we should leave.
Which of the above conditionals are true and which are false?
Are there any other relevant conditionals that we should consider in this context? (Note: only conditionals.)
[1] If we'll make the world a worse place in the long run by staying in Iraq, then we should leave.
[2] If we'll make things worse for the Iraqis in the long run by staying in Iraq, then we should leave.
[3] If we'll make things worse for the U.S. in the long run by staying in Iraq, then we should leave.
Which of the above conditionals are true and which are false?
Are there any other relevant conditionals that we should consider in this context? (Note: only conditionals.)
posted by Winston Smith at
5:39 PM
3 Comments:
Well, c'mon, they're all true! They all boil down to "If staying will make things worse, we should leave." To paraphrase a wiser man, "If we go there will be trouble, if we stay it will be double."
I can't think of any other conditionals right now that might meet your last criterion; indeed I somehow find it too vague to respond to. I'm not sure what you're looking for.
The "What next?" problem of Iraq flows from the fact that the Bushist attitude toward Iraq is that of a rapist standing over a victim chained in his basement after days of brutality and torture. Even if it were possible to unrape someone, it's the last thing the rapist would want to do. Leaving Iraq at this point is like opening the bulkhead door and letting the injured, traumatized victim run off into the desert.
I fear you're in the grip of some misunderstandings, Tom.
First, there's nothing vague about limiting the discussion of conditionals.
Second, it is, in fact, *your* gloss on the relevant claims that's vague--far, far vaguer than mine. That is, "if it makes things worse, then we should leave" leaves 'worse' vague, whereas I've been careful to distinguish three different senses of 'worse.' It's extremely important to distinguis these three different ways in which our presence might make things worse.
Finally, while the Bushies are incompetent fools who seem to have insufficient regard for human life, they aren't the moral equivalent of kidnapper/rapists.
I'd like to comment in more detail, but I can't seem to paste from the original without somehow making my keyboard crazy. See if my thinking cap is on more straight than before...?
So: [1] Yes, we should leave; the whole world is more important than any part.
[2] Depends on who you ask, how things are worse, and how long is the long run. Bush would say stay; I would say go. Did you know that Central Asia used to be a rich place, but after 800 years has still not recovered from the Mongols? I think we're going to leave Iraq the same way.
[3] Since the government is supposed to do what is best for its own country, if not any other, if staying makes it worse for the US in the long run, we should leave. Since there are more people in the US, a cold mathematical decision would favor the welfare of the US over that of Iraq; and that of the world over that of the US.
I think it is demonstrably true that this conflict has hurt both nations and the whole world palpably, and in ways that will persist. I don't know what is the best way to do a withdrawal, but that doesn't mean we should listen to the people who got us into this mess.
Often military forces stay in a bad position because the alternative is a rout, i.e. a sudden collapse of the whole line. I think this is the sort of fear that keeps us paralyzed in Iraq. Think Saigon rooftops and helicopters.
As for the Bushies and their friends: I've been scared to death of these people for 25 years. I really, really, really really, really think they ARE the moral equivalent of kidnapper/rapists. Great evil always wears the mask of great virtue, or it could never get decent people to support it until it became too powerful to resist.
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