tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5264937.post113900726254989942..comments2024-03-26T12:23:29.784-04:00Comments on Philosoraptor: Winston Smithhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08780746334199630779noreply@blogger.comBlogger7125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5264937.post-1139379832557636842006-02-08T01:23:00.000-05:002006-02-08T01:23:00.000-05:00The died in vain thing came up in the Reagan-Monda...The died in vain thing came up in the Reagan-Mondale campaign in 1984, with George HW Bush saying I think that Mondale had said that the marines in Lebanon "died in shame." Nice guy. <A HREF="http://openweb.tvnews.vanderbilt.edu/1984-10/1984-10-12-CBS-2.html" REL="nofollow">This</A> is the only pertinent link I can find right now.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5264937.post-1139240466009302862006-02-06T10:41:00.000-05:002006-02-06T10:41:00.000-05:00As a practical matter, when faced with a loaded in...As a practical matter, when faced with a loaded interpretation of what you've said (or merely one that you don't like), do not treat it as a yes-or-no question. Instead, make the points you want to make, not the points your adversary wants you to make.<BR/><BR/>In this case, say something like, "Those brave, valiant soldiers would be alive today still serving their country but for the deceit of Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5264937.post-1139167395139519562006-02-05T14:23:00.000-05:002006-02-05T14:23:00.000-05:00By Grotius' understanding of war 400 years ago, th...By Grotius' understanding of war 400 years ago, the one in Iraq was over a month after it started.<BR/><BR/>The only question now is whether we abandon moderates like al-Sistani ("moderate" being a relative term in the Muslim world these days) to the crazies.<BR/><BR/>I do not know Grotius' position on allowing allies to be slaughtered if there is a perception one cannot "win."Tom Van Dykehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07121072404143877596noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5264937.post-1139075095264035742006-02-04T12:44:00.000-05:002006-02-04T12:44:00.000-05:00So what's rhetorically bad about saying that our s...So what's rhetorically bad about saying that our soldiers died in vain?<BR/><BR/>We should devote a whole post/discussion to this, but here's some fast thoughts:<BR/><BR/>(a) The fact that almost no one would say it provides some evidence that, rhetorically speaking, it looks like a losing move.<BR/><BR/>(b) which doesn't mean that it isn't true. Jared's got it right IMHO. But anyway: the Winston Smithhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08780746334199630779noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5264937.post-1139044869212960372006-02-04T04:21:00.000-05:002006-02-04T04:21:00.000-05:00It depends on what kind of mistake the war is. An ...It depends on what kind of mistake the war is. An unjust war? A poorly planned and conceived war that is likely to fail, even though it had the potential to do good? What kind of mistake are we talking about here? I think the only time when it makes sense to say that a soldier died in vain is when we know that the chances of success are either close to nill when fighting for a just cause, or whenAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5264937.post-1139038737416796392006-02-04T02:38:00.000-05:002006-02-04T02:38:00.000-05:00Kerry's "What do you ask a man to be the last man ...Kerry's "What do you ask a man to be the last man to die for a mistake?" is in my view a simple refutation of the above fallacious attack.rilkefanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01189347779617969628noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5264937.post-1139017724349251392006-02-03T20:48:00.000-05:002006-02-03T20:48:00.000-05:00I say yes, and exactly how am I going to get my rh...I say yes, and exactly how am I going to get my rhetorical ass kicked? The war was a mistake, the leaders who started it made a mistake, and it is their fault that the soldiers died in vain. Their sacrifice was probably made with noble intent, but it was in vain. <BR/><BR/>How am I getting my ass kicked again? Especially since last I checked, this is the majority position in the country (thatAnonymousnoreply@blogger.com